oil damaged by cold?

RoadKill

RoadKill

New member
I went for a ride Saturday, and I noticed that my clutch was grabbing even when I had it pulled in fully.
I also noticed that it wouldn't stick when cold but after it had warmed up the clutch would start grabbing.
Sunday I took it out and the same problems persisted.
The bike was sitting in the garage with no heat and we had a few days of 5°F temperature.
it also sat for about a month during all of this cold.

So I changed the oil and filter to see if that would help and it did. IT has worked perfectly since the oil change.
the old oil was mobil 1 full synth and had 1800 miles on it.

could my oil have been damaged?
 
JSP

JSP

Administrator
Old oil can definitely go bad. It can separate and break down, form condensation, etc. Take some old oil and put it in a milk jug. Leave it outside for a month or so and look at it. Would you put that back in your bike and run it? ;)
 
FZ8Panda

FZ8Panda

Member
Prob the cold weather had an affect on it. It's been cold as hell this winter in NY. My bike was wonky here and there too although nothing like you described. I'm glad you fixed it though and it wasn't anything major. :tup:
 
Kardiac996

Kardiac996

New member
I had the same issue this weekend and turned out to be a clutch line adjustment for me.

Typically If im winterizing my bike, I put in a fresh set of oil and then let it sit and its fine as it hasn't had a chance to break down from use yet.

If i happen to have miles in the oil before winter hits and cant change it I make sure to run the bike once till temp per week to keep the oil mixed.

Don't know if this is necessary to run once a week but it makes me feel better at least.

hopefully a garage is in my future.

Glad to see yours got ironed out with a quick change!
 
reALIGNed

reALIGNed

New member
JSP said:
Old oil can definitely go bad. It can separate and break down, form condensation, etc. Take some old oil and put it in a milk jug. Leave it outside for a month or so and look at it. Would you put that back in your bike and run it? ;)
Click to expand...

How does "old oil" go bad,.......... if its used and broken down, then its already bad. (btw, he uses Mobil 1 and has 1800 miles on it, far from being old)

Roadkill, what is happening here is the viscosity has changed from the cold weather, it has become slightly thicker and thus decreases its ability to flow normally. Upon starting the cold engine, the thick oil was slightly preventing the clutch plates from disengaging completely, and once the clutch disc's separated enough to allow oil to penetrate between them.....again the thick oil was preventing the clutch to engage (grab) causing slippage. When you poured in the new oil, it was probably at room temperature and flowed through out the motor easier and allowing the clutch to operate normally. Next time you encounter a cold weather start, allow the engine to warm up a little longer, and your good to go, no need for an expensive oil change.
What you experienced is normal for a (cold) wet clutch.
 
RoadKill

RoadKill

New member
reALIGNed said:
How does "old oil" go bad,.......... if its used and broken down, then its already bad. (btw, he uses Mobil 1 and has 1800 miles on it, far from being old)

Roadkill, what is happening here is the viscosity has changed from the cold weather, it has become slightly thicker and thus decreases its ability to flow normally. Upon starting the cold engine, the thick oil was slightly preventing the clutch plates from disengaging completely, and once the clutch disc's separated enough to allow oil to penetrate between them.....again the thick oil was preventing the clutch to engage (grab) causing slippage. When you poured in the new oil, it was probably at room temperature and flowed through out the motor easier and allowing the clutch to operate normally. Next time you encounter a cold weather start, allow the engine to warm up a little longer, and your good to go, no need for an expensive oil change.
What you experienced is normal for a (cold) wet clutch.
Click to expand...

read the top post again lad ;) particularly this line "I also noticed that it wouldn't stick when cold but after it had warmed up the clutch would start grabbing."
and when i say warmed up i mean 180 degrees and riding for a half hour at least.
 
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L

leem00

New member
reALIGNed said:
How does "old oil" go bad,.......... if its used and broken down, then its already bad. (btw, he uses Mobil 1 and has 1800 miles on it, far from being old)

Roadkill, what is happening here is the viscosity has changed from the cold weather, it has become slightly thicker and thus decreases its ability to flow normally. Upon starting the cold engine, the thick oil was slightly preventing the clutch plates from disengaging completely, and once the clutch disc's separated enough to allow oil to penetrate between them.....again the thick oil was preventing the clutch to engage (grab) causing slippage. When you poured in the new oil, it was probably at room temperature and flowed through out the motor easier and allowing the clutch to operate normally. Next time you encounter a cold weather start, allow the engine to warm up a little longer, and your good to go, no need for an expensive oil change.
What you experienced is normal for a (cold) wet clutch.
Click to expand...

Oil that sits will varnish just like old gas...
 
reALIGNed

reALIGNed

New member
RoadKill said:
read the top post again lad ;) particularly this line "I also noticed that it wouldn't stick when cold but after it had warmed up the clutch would start grabbing."
and when i say warmed up i mean 180 degrees and riding for a half hour at least.
Click to expand...

Not sure I see your point here
 
JSP

JSP

Administrator
reALIGNed said:
How does "old oil" go bad,.......... if its used and broken down, then its already bad. (btw, he uses Mobil 1 and has 1800 miles on it, far from being old)

Roadkill, what is happening here is the viscosity has changed from the cold weather, it has become slightly thicker and thus decreases its ability to flow normally. Upon starting the cold engine, the thick oil was slightly preventing the clutch plates from disengaging completely, and once the clutch disc's separated enough to allow oil to penetrate between them.....again the thick oil was preventing the clutch to engage (grab) causing slippage. When you poured in the new oil, it was probably at room temperature and flowed through out the motor easier and allowing the clutch to operate normally. Next time you encounter a cold weather start, allow the engine to warm up a little longer, and your good to go, no need for an expensive oil change.
What you experienced is normal for a (cold) wet clutch.
Click to expand...


Old (READ USED) oil goes MOA BAD with time if left to sit. :D Once contaminated with by products of the combustion process, moisture, etc.. oil turns acidic. It will further break down with time.

That is why you do not want to store your bike with old, used oil in it for the winter. You should drain the oil and fill with fresh for storage. Same with gas (with stabilizer).

:welcome:

When talking about oil going BAD, we are talking about USED oil that has gone through the combustion process. Not new oil that has not been used yet. And yes, oil does have a shelf life if the container has been opened and now exposed to air/moisture. (Still a long shelf life though). Sealed, unopened oil will last a very long time.

Not saying that is for sure what is going on with OP, just saying.. ;)
 
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9 Lives

9 Lives

New member
Most engine oils have a 5 year shelf life even in an unopened bottle. You would think they would put a best before date on the bottle, who knows how long its been sitting in storage before you buy it. I don't think that cold has anything to do with it, I have been storing motorcycles, quads, snowmobiles over the summer/winter season for years and have never had a problem with the oil and it gets a heck of a lot colder that 5*F where I live.
 
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reALIGNed

reALIGNed

New member
Getting completely off topic. I totally understand the chemical degradation of used oil. I am saying his 1800 mile synthetic oil was not "ruined" from sitting, as JSP and leem00 are thinking. And if it was contaminated it would cause early engine wear,...not an inoperative clutch.
 
JSP

JSP

Administrator
reALIGNed said:
Getting completely off topic. I totally understand the chemical degradation of used oil. I am saying his 1800 mile synthetic oil was not "ruined" from sitting, as JSP and leem00 are thinking. And if it was contaminated it would cause early engine wear,...not an inoperative clutch.
Click to expand...

Just saying it could be a possibility. Mobil 1 is good oil, yes. 1800 miles, but how long has it been in there to get that 1800 miles. Then sat unused for a month. Clutch uses that same oil. OP says works great now with new fresh oil...

Possibilities... thats all. ;) We can carry on to another possibility now. :p
 
reALIGNed

reALIGNed

New member
9 Lives said:
Most engine oils have a 5 year shelf life even in an unopened bottle. You would think they would put a best before date on the bottle, who knows how long its been sitting in storage before you buy it. I don't think that cold has anything to do with it, I have been storing motorcycles, quads, snowmobiles over the summer/winter season for years and have never had a problem with the oil and it gets a heck of a lot colder that 5*F where I live.
Click to expand...

Do a simple pour test, let a sample bottle sit outside in the cold and an identical sample sit in the house, and in the morning pour them both into a drain pan and see which one flows faster. Now imagine this thicker oil trying to flow through your cold engine, ..it will but not as fast as in a warm environment.
 
JSP

JSP

Administrator
Should a proper weight oil (for the temps) still cause slipping? Assuming OP was using a proper weight for that cold of a temp.
 
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